The Bazzite drama is so fucking funny to me actually.
This is exactly what I would expect would happen to a proprietary "gamer" distro that uses Reddit/Discord as its primary way of communication.
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13These guys are all incredibly incompetent and don't know shit about computers or programming.
All they know is how to package a bunch of a proprietary shit together "for convenience".
Other distros could do this too but they don't because it sucks.
@SuperDicq what distro there is that can replace bazzite (i.e. with boot-to-steam and other similar niceties)
boot-to-steam and other similar nicetiesNiceties? Why would I want my computer to boot into a proprietary DRM platform? If I wanted that I would've just bought a gaming console.
@SuperDicq you don't want but i do
@hj@shigusegubu.club There is no point in having a free operating system if all you're going to do is launch Steam and play proprietary games. Just buy a Nintendo Switch instead.
@SuperDicq point is having ability to modify everything and be able to play anything.
@hj@shigusegubu.club But you can't modify anything on these types of distros.
@SuperDicq yes you can
@hj@shigusegubu.club All the proprietary software they have installed with you can't.
@SuperDicq for steam there is decky, everything else you can modify as in normal linux distro.
@hj@shigusegubu.club For a gaming OS the proposition of "everything except the things that the user actually meaningfully interacts with" is essentially nothing.
@SuperDicq what?
@hj@shigusegubu.club You interact mostly with the steam client and its games on a gaming OS like this. You can't modify those.
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@SuperDicq you can modify steam and its UI with decky. You can install mods on games.
@hj@shigusegubu.club That's a very limited form of modification. It's like saying Windows is free software because it allows me to set a wallpaper. You need it's source code to make real modifications.
@SuperDicq @hj adobe photoshop is more freedom respecting than gimp because it’s more usable for creating art.
Actual opinion by a talker at a previous fosdem
Actual opinion by a talker at a previous fosdem
@sun@shitposter.world @hj@shigusegubu.club FOSDEM is 50% free and 50% open source.
There's a lot of shit takes at FOSDEM but if you actually go there and choose to hang out with the people from the FSF and/or various GNU projects represented there you won't have to deal with that.
@SuperDicq @hj @sun There's a lot of shit takes at FOSDEM, but if you actually go there and choose to hang out with the people not from the FSF and/or various GNU projects represented there, you won't have to deal with that.*
@SuperDicq @sun i just wanna hangout with pleromabros, dunk and dab on mastodon and get drunk
@hj@shigusegubu.club @sun@shitposter.world That's too, there's a lot of fedi people at FOSDEM too. The XMPP people are great too.
@hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info @hj@shigusegubu.club @sun@shitposter.world What the fuck are you even talking about?
@SuperDicq @hj @hakui @sun You need to hold Ctrl+Shift for that to work. Very few people know about that.
@phnt@fluffytail.org @hj@shigusegubu.club @hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info @sun@shitposter.world You don't even have to do that there's literally a GUI option on the tool where you tick "Fixed Aspect ratio" and it will be a perfect circle.
@sun @SuperDicq @hj
>adobe photoshop is more freedom respecting than gimp because it’s more usable for creating art.
that doesn't mean anything, that's like saying "China is more free than the US because it's easier to get around by transport"
>adobe photoshop is more freedom respecting than gimp because it’s more usable for creating art.
that doesn't mean anything, that's like saying "China is more free than the US because it's easier to get around by transport"
@yomiel@new.asbestos.cafe @sun@shitposter.world @hj@shigusegubu.club China is more free than the US because you can go to school and not get shot.
@SuperDicq @hj @sun @yomiel It seems there's a higher chance of getting stabbed or blown up at a school in China; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_attacks_in_China?useskin=monobook
@Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @hj@shigusegubu.club @sun@shitposter.world @yomiel@new.asbestos.cafe So the Onion was wrong when they said "this is the only country where this regularly happens"?
@sun @SuperDicq krita is more free tho
@hj @SuperDicq @sun Krita is less free as the license is GPLv3-only, while GIMP is GPLv3-or-later.
But it turns out that a drawing program is more suitable for drawing that an image manipulation program.
But it turns out that a drawing program is more suitable for drawing that an image manipulation program.
@Suiseiseki @hj @SuperDicq @sun >GPLv3-only
>GPLv3-or-later
neither of them is as free as GPLv3+NIGGER
>GPLv3-or-later
neither of them is as free as GPLv3+NIGGER
@hakui @SuperDicq @hj @sun All other non-permissive additional terms are considered "further restrictions" within the meaning of section 10. If the Program as you received it, or any part of it, contains a notice stating that it is governed by this License along with a term that is a further restriction, you may remove that term.
@Suiseiseki @SuperDicq @hj @sun sounds like you don't have the freedom to say NIGGER in your license file 
@hakui @SuperDicq @hj @sun Everyone is permitted to copy and distribute verbatim copies of this license document, but changing it is not allowed.
@Suiseiseki @SuperDicq @hj @sun @hakui that only applies to the license as your recieve it, included with software. you can absolutely license a new work you created under the gplv3-or-later+nigger. that's not a violation of freedom.
@HatkeshiatorTND @SuperDicq @hj @sun @hakui You do not have copyright permission to modify the GPLv3 if you include the GNU preamble or mention GNU (otherwise people could modify the GPLv3 into a proprietary license and call it "GPLv3", or insert some retardation into it).
@hakui @HatkeshiatorTND @Suiseiseki @SuperDicq @hj @sun the biggest threat to Linux is the people who use it
@Wiz@tsundere.love @hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info @HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @hj@shigusegubu.club @sun@shitposter.world The biggest thread is Hurd taking over and Linus Torvalds will be in shambles. The year of the full GNU operating system without Linux is soon going to be upon us!
@SuperDicq @hj @hakui @Suiseiseki @sun @Wiz it already is. you can use xorg on it and run it on amd64 architectures. 75% of debian packages work on debian hurd. i assume guix hurd is only doing better given it doesn't aim to centrally plan all packaging!
@HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social @hj@shigusegubu.club @hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @sun@shitposter.world @Wiz@tsundere.love VESA-mode isn't very ideal for desktop use but you can already run GNU/Hurd on a server.
I'm personally a lot more hyped about the Guix GNU/Hurd distro, since it also uses GNU Shepherd instead of systemd.
@HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social @hj@shigusegubu.club @hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @sun@shitposter.world @Wiz@tsundere.love Guix GNU/Hurd is like the first real GNU operating system.
Userland: GNU
Init: GNU
Kernel: GNU
Bootloader: GNU
Package management: GNU
@SuperDicq @hj @hakui @sun @Wiz @HatkeshiatorTND Guix GNU/GNU Linux-libre is a real GNU OS as well.
Userland: GNU
Init: GNU
Kernel: GNU Linux-libre
Bootloader: GNU
Package management: GNU
Userland: GNU
Init: GNU
Kernel: GNU Linux-libre
Bootloader: GNU
Package management: GNU
@Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @hj@shigusegubu.club @hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info @sun@shitposter.world @Wiz@tsundere.love @HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social Yeah but dumb people can still be like "So it is Linux?????", not possible with GNU/Hurd
@hj@shigusegubu.club @hakui @Suiseiseki @sun @Wiz@tsundere.love @SuperDicq it is so dumb only the kernel is a GNU fork of Linux. How does that make it not GNU.
@tusharhero@mathstodon.xyz @hj@shigusegubu.club @hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info @Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com @sun@shitposter.world @Wiz@tsundere.love I think it does but other people don't. I kinda wanna use Hurd just to spite those people specifically.
@SuperDicq @hj @hakui @Suiseiseki @Wiz @tusharhero Hurd sadly is built on crummy outdated microkernel architecture why can’t they just adopt an existing sel4 kernel
I tried to boot hurd in 2015 but was also experimenting with Inferno as well. I'm having a hard time getting it to build on modern linuxes.
@SuperDicq @hj @hakui @Suiseiseki @sun @Wiz @HatkeshiatorTND I'd rather have an oxidized year in which all GNU code has been removed from the Linux operating system
@latein @HatkeshiatorTND @SuperDicq @hj @sun @Wiz @hakui Linux will never be an operating system - cope.
@Suiseiseki @HatkeshiatorTND @SuperDicq @hj @sun @Wiz @hakui “I use Linux as my operating system,” I state proudly to the unkempt, bearded man. He swivels around in his desk chair with a devilish gleam in his eyes, ready to mansplain with extreme precision. “Actually”, he says with a grin, "Linux is just the kernel. You use GNU+Linux!’ I don’t miss a beat and reply with a smirk, “I use Alpine, a distro that doesn’t include the GNU coreutils, or any other GNU code. It’s Linux, but it’s not GNU+Linux.”
The smile quickly drops from the man’s face. His body begins convulsing and he foams at the mouth and drops to the floor with a sickly thud. As he writhes around he screams “I-IT WAS COMPILED WITH GCC! THAT MEANS IT’S STILL GNU!” Coolly, I reply “If windows was compiled with gcc, would that make it GNU?” I interrupt his response with “-and work is being made on the kernel to make it more compiler-agnostic. Even you were correct, you wont be for long.”
With a sickly wheeze, the last of the man’s life is ejected from his body. He lies on the floor, cold and limp. I’ve womansplained him to death.
The smile quickly drops from the man’s face. His body begins convulsing and he foams at the mouth and drops to the floor with a sickly thud. As he writhes around he screams “I-IT WAS COMPILED WITH GCC! THAT MEANS IT’S STILL GNU!” Coolly, I reply “If windows was compiled with gcc, would that make it GNU?” I interrupt his response with “-and work is being made on the kernel to make it more compiler-agnostic. Even you were correct, you wont be for long.”
With a sickly wheeze, the last of the man’s life is ejected from his body. He lies on the floor, cold and limp. I’ve womansplained him to death.
@latein @HatkeshiatorTND @SuperDicq @hj @sun @Wiz @hakui "I use Linux as my operating system", I state proudly to the unkempt, bearded man. He swivels around in his desk chair with a GNUish gleam in his eyes, ready to GNUsplain with extreme precision. "Actually, he says with a grin, Linux is only a kernel, a proprietary one at that." he took a powerful breath into his thick GNU/Lungs and continued; "Most likely you use GNU slash Linux!' I don't miss a beat and reply with a proprietary smirk, "I use Alpine, a distro that doesn't include the GNU coreutils, or any other GNU code. it's Linux, but it's not GNU/Linux".
The smile quickly enhances on the man's face. His body begin emanating a holy GNU/Glow as he prepared for yet another GNU/Exorcism. Being possessed by a proprietary daemon, I soon began foaming at the mouth, dropped to the floor and started to writhe and scream. He calmly continued with his interjection; "Alpine is a BusyBox/Linux distro. BusyBox is a inferior clone of GNU under a GNU license. Even though Alpine's developers attempt to not include GNU and make an utter garbage distro, they still use GCC and many GNU libraries to compile it, as well as including the following GNU packages in the default install; gdbm gmp gnutls grub libgcc libidn2 ncurses parted readline tar wget and of course coreutils. While there is an edgy minimal installer that excludes GNU coreutils, it still includes includes grub and gnutls and wget etc. Additionally, the first thing most Alpine users do is install the GNU software that's missing (although most of them don't even register that they're installing GNU software). Furthermore, GNU coreutils is only one GNU package out of 388." The daemon replied; "If windows was compiled with GCC, Would that make it GNU?" and demonically interrupted before he could respond with; "and work is being made on the kernel to make it more Compiler-agnostic. Even you were correct, you wont be for long."
He signed and continued; "Yes, that would make it; quote compiled with GNU unquote. Furthermore, there are indeed distributions of GNU for windows, which does make GNU/Windows if you install them - but those only exist to give the suckers a taste of freedom and you're better off installing the real thing (GNU/Linux-libre). It's a real shame that Linux puts any development work into ensuring that it can be compiled with compilers that aren't under a freedom-defending license, rather than using all the fine GNU extensions GCC makes available, but that's sadly to be expected from a proprietary kernel project - although Linux is indeed freedom respecting once exorcised to make GNU Linux-libre. I'm always correct despite the proprietary efforts to make me wrong." With a sickly wheeze, the last of the proprietary daemon was exorcised from my body. It lay on the floor, cold and limp - he interjected it to death with the good word of freedom.
Now that I had been saved, I begged for forgiveness. He proclaimed; "Forgiveness is not required - all you need to do is repent. Repentance consists of installing a free distro on your computer to replace the proprietary Alpine. A list of free distros is available at; https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-distros.html";
The smile quickly enhances on the man's face. His body begin emanating a holy GNU/Glow as he prepared for yet another GNU/Exorcism. Being possessed by a proprietary daemon, I soon began foaming at the mouth, dropped to the floor and started to writhe and scream. He calmly continued with his interjection; "Alpine is a BusyBox/Linux distro. BusyBox is a inferior clone of GNU under a GNU license. Even though Alpine's developers attempt to not include GNU and make an utter garbage distro, they still use GCC and many GNU libraries to compile it, as well as including the following GNU packages in the default install; gdbm gmp gnutls grub libgcc libidn2 ncurses parted readline tar wget and of course coreutils. While there is an edgy minimal installer that excludes GNU coreutils, it still includes includes grub and gnutls and wget etc. Additionally, the first thing most Alpine users do is install the GNU software that's missing (although most of them don't even register that they're installing GNU software). Furthermore, GNU coreutils is only one GNU package out of 388." The daemon replied; "If windows was compiled with GCC, Would that make it GNU?" and demonically interrupted before he could respond with; "and work is being made on the kernel to make it more Compiler-agnostic. Even you were correct, you wont be for long."
He signed and continued; "Yes, that would make it; quote compiled with GNU unquote. Furthermore, there are indeed distributions of GNU for windows, which does make GNU/Windows if you install them - but those only exist to give the suckers a taste of freedom and you're better off installing the real thing (GNU/Linux-libre). It's a real shame that Linux puts any development work into ensuring that it can be compiled with compilers that aren't under a freedom-defending license, rather than using all the fine GNU extensions GCC makes available, but that's sadly to be expected from a proprietary kernel project - although Linux is indeed freedom respecting once exorcised to make GNU Linux-libre. I'm always correct despite the proprietary efforts to make me wrong." With a sickly wheeze, the last of the proprietary daemon was exorcised from my body. It lay on the floor, cold and limp - he interjected it to death with the good word of freedom.
Now that I had been saved, I begged for forgiveness. He proclaimed; "Forgiveness is not required - all you need to do is repent. Repentance consists of installing a free distro on your computer to replace the proprietary Alpine. A list of free distros is available at; https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-distros.html";
@Suiseiseki @latein @HatkeshiatorTND @SuperDicq @Wiz @hj @sun congrats, you somehow turned it into a lefty meme
didn't read though
didn't read though
@hakui @latein @Suiseiseki @SuperDicq @hj @sun @Wiz is this brief enough for you?
xkcd-if-randall-had-male-parts-where-his-vulva-is.png
xkcd-if-randall-had-male-parts-where-his-vulva-is.png
@HatkeshiatorTND @Suiseiseki @SuperDicq @hj @sun @Wiz @hakui
>the first thing its users do is install the GNU software they're "missing"!
>source: it is axiomatically true in my cult
>it comes with GNU coreutils by default (which is a blatant lie, it having grub also being a lie as far as I can tell)
>even tho higher up gniggers admit that it not using glibc makes it not GNU I know better
>incessantly repeats the exact point that Windows would be GNU if it was compiled with GCC
>and there's a GNU package somewhere in a repo you can optionally install, that makes it GNU!
>fine GCC extensions (vendor lock yourself to shitty infrastructure intentionally designed to be useless for compiler and language tooling developers because some of them might use it for something proprietary, which instead created the current ubiquity of clang/LLVM. yet somehow there's less freedom there because some piece of paper says you can't use it a certain way on top of the designer making it so you can't use it as a library)
>the first thing its users do is install the GNU software they're "missing"!
>source: it is axiomatically true in my cult
>it comes with GNU coreutils by default (which is a blatant lie, it having grub also being a lie as far as I can tell)
>even tho higher up gniggers admit that it not using glibc makes it not GNU I know better
>incessantly repeats the exact point that Windows would be GNU if it was compiled with GCC
>and there's a GNU package somewhere in a repo you can optionally install, that makes it GNU!
>fine GCC extensions (vendor lock yourself to shitty infrastructure intentionally designed to be useless for compiler and language tooling developers because some of them might use it for something proprietary, which instead created the current ubiquity of clang/LLVM. yet somehow there's less freedom there because some piece of paper says you can't use it a certain way on top of the designer making it so you can't use it as a library)
@latein @HatkeshiatorTND @SuperDicq @hj @sun @Wiz @hakui The claim that Alpine does not use GNU coreutils is false - Alpine is designed to use GNU coreutils, except there is a cut down installer without coreutils just to be edgy (the user goes and installs coreutils later).
All of such false claims are dependent on the user thinking it's; "all Linux" and not actually looking at it and realizing it's GNU/Linux.
https://www.alpinelinux.org/downloads/
>GnuPG signatures right there on the installation page.
Looks pretty GNU to me, but lets keep going.
>"Just enough to get you started. Network connection is required."
It's clear that the standard install image is just enough to get you started for the install of any of the missing GNU packages.
7z l alpine-standard-3.23.0-x86_64.iso
2025-12-04 02:51:04 D.... boot/grub
2025-12-04 02:48:21 ..... 1474560 1474560 boot/grub/efi.img
There's the GNU GRUB OS - it's clearly GNU/Linux, but lets keep going.
cd apks/x86_64
ls gnutls-3.8.11-r0.apk libunistring-1.4.1-r0.apk ncurses-terminfo-base-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk wget-1.25.0-r2.apk gmp-6.3.0-r4.apk libncursesw-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk libidn2-2.3.8-r0.apk
That's a lot of GNU packages for something not GNU and that's ignoring the GNU dependences for all the other packages.
But there's an "Extended" install image as well; "Most common used packages included. Suitable for routers and servers." - which seems to in fact be what you would use if you don't want pretty much nothing to be included, just to be edgy.
cd apks/x86_64
Just in one pass I found;
ls coreutils-9.8-r1.apk coreutils-env-9.8-r1.apk coreutils-fmt-9.8-r1.apk coreutils-sha512sum-9.8-r1.apk gdbm-1.26-r0.apk gmp-6.3.0-r4.apk gnutls-3.8.11-r0.apk grub-2.12-r8.apk grub-bios-2.12-r8.apk grub-efi-2.12-r8.apk libgcc-15.2.0-r2.apk libidn2-2.3.8-r0.apk libncursesw-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk ncurses-terminfo-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk ncurses-terminfo-base-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk parted-3.6-r2.apk readline-8.3.1-r0.apk tar-1.35-r4.apk wget-1.25.0-r2.apk
Yes, that's right, Alpine GNU/Linux ships GNU coreutils, GNU grub, GNU ncurses, GMP, libgcc, GNU libidn2, GNU parted, GNU readline, GNU tar and GNU wget by default!
All the other packages look very similar to what comes with the default install of a typical GNU/Linux, a lot of proprietary software is included too.
(There's even Quagga there, which is an interesting choice and well that is still GNU code, as it was forked from GNU zebra).
Therefore Alpine is a GNU/Linux distro (with the only large change seemingly being musl instead of glibc - while GNU coreutils is used and even the GNU GRUB OS is used), although there is a barebones BusyBox/Linux installer just to be edgy (but of course still has GNU in it).
>>the first thing its users do is install the GNU software they're "missing"!
Source; Anyone who isn't insane will realize how much important software is missing and install it.
>>it comes with GNU coreutils by default (which is a blatant lie, it having grub also being a lie as far as I can tell)
>Tell the truth of what I determined by looking at the non-edgy installer. >I'm a liar.
>>it not using glibc makes it not GNU I know better
I know better than such weak willed sort, as merely not using glibc doesn't magically make a GNU distro with most packages you would expect from a GNU distro, except for glibc, not GNU.
>>and there's a GNU package somewhere in a repo you can optionally install, that makes it GNU!
All of the popular GNU packages (several dozen) are available in the repository - I'm not going to handhold you, you have to look yourself.
>there because some piece of paper says you can't use it a certain way on top of the designer making it so you can't use it as a library
The license says you can use it for any purpose - it just doesn't grant the power to take the users freedom.
You can use GCC as a library - for example GCC JIT, the developers just didn't go out of their way to assist proprietary software developers in making GCC proprietary.
All of such false claims are dependent on the user thinking it's; "all Linux" and not actually looking at it and realizing it's GNU/Linux.
https://www.alpinelinux.org/downloads/
>GnuPG signatures right there on the installation page.
Looks pretty GNU to me, but lets keep going.
>"Just enough to get you started. Network connection is required."
It's clear that the standard install image is just enough to get you started for the install of any of the missing GNU packages.
7z l alpine-standard-3.23.0-x86_64.iso
2025-12-04 02:51:04 D.... boot/grub
2025-12-04 02:48:21 ..... 1474560 1474560 boot/grub/efi.img
There's the GNU GRUB OS - it's clearly GNU/Linux, but lets keep going.
cd apks/x86_64
ls gnutls-3.8.11-r0.apk libunistring-1.4.1-r0.apk ncurses-terminfo-base-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk wget-1.25.0-r2.apk gmp-6.3.0-r4.apk libncursesw-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk libidn2-2.3.8-r0.apk
That's a lot of GNU packages for something not GNU and that's ignoring the GNU dependences for all the other packages.
But there's an "Extended" install image as well; "Most common used packages included. Suitable for routers and servers." - which seems to in fact be what you would use if you don't want pretty much nothing to be included, just to be edgy.
cd apks/x86_64
Just in one pass I found;
ls coreutils-9.8-r1.apk coreutils-env-9.8-r1.apk coreutils-fmt-9.8-r1.apk coreutils-sha512sum-9.8-r1.apk gdbm-1.26-r0.apk gmp-6.3.0-r4.apk gnutls-3.8.11-r0.apk grub-2.12-r8.apk grub-bios-2.12-r8.apk grub-efi-2.12-r8.apk libgcc-15.2.0-r2.apk libidn2-2.3.8-r0.apk libncursesw-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk ncurses-terminfo-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk ncurses-terminfo-base-6.5_p20251123-r0.apk parted-3.6-r2.apk readline-8.3.1-r0.apk tar-1.35-r4.apk wget-1.25.0-r2.apk
Yes, that's right, Alpine GNU/Linux ships GNU coreutils, GNU grub, GNU ncurses, GMP, libgcc, GNU libidn2, GNU parted, GNU readline, GNU tar and GNU wget by default!
All the other packages look very similar to what comes with the default install of a typical GNU/Linux, a lot of proprietary software is included too.
(There's even Quagga there, which is an interesting choice and well that is still GNU code, as it was forked from GNU zebra).
Therefore Alpine is a GNU/Linux distro (with the only large change seemingly being musl instead of glibc - while GNU coreutils is used and even the GNU GRUB OS is used), although there is a barebones BusyBox/Linux installer just to be edgy (but of course still has GNU in it).
>>the first thing its users do is install the GNU software they're "missing"!
Source; Anyone who isn't insane will realize how much important software is missing and install it.
>>it comes with GNU coreutils by default (which is a blatant lie, it having grub also being a lie as far as I can tell)
>Tell the truth of what I determined by looking at the non-edgy installer. >I'm a liar.
>>it not using glibc makes it not GNU I know better
I know better than such weak willed sort, as merely not using glibc doesn't magically make a GNU distro with most packages you would expect from a GNU distro, except for glibc, not GNU.
>>and there's a GNU package somewhere in a repo you can optionally install, that makes it GNU!
All of the popular GNU packages (several dozen) are available in the repository - I'm not going to handhold you, you have to look yourself.
>there because some piece of paper says you can't use it a certain way on top of the designer making it so you can't use it as a library
The license says you can use it for any purpose - it just doesn't grant the power to take the users freedom.
You can use GCC as a library - for example GCC JIT, the developers just didn't go out of their way to assist proprietary software developers in making GCC proprietary.