Egregoros · Phoenix Framework

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Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

cli tools not just walking me through it and instead having me ace the flags, is really just a niggerlicious holdover from the 80s and I don't care that I'm a noob and don't have 20000 hours grinding away at moldy ass system code.

it should be able to detect if you were running from cli or a shell script, and if it is the former, it should just tell you what it is gonna do if you hit enter, which is the default, and if you want something else just have a little wizard that assembles the command into a line at the bottom so then when you walked through the options, you have
>$ foo --flag-one 12 --flag-two /path/to/file ...
and so on and then you just hit enter and it runs it and you can copy-paste the command for later.

I really don't see what the problem is just doing it like that except it would take a bit of work to set up the wizard. if everything had wizard support though, you could make it be "$ wizard foo" though, instead of "$ man foo" and then it wouldn't really take that long to make one

RT: https://poa.st/objects/d58b406a-d72c-430b-8755-e6a35c5bae4d

@professionalbigot69@poa.st remote

@WandererUber either read the man page, use a gui or get an indian to do whatever you want it to do

Replying to @professionalbigot69@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@professionalbigot69 either engage with what I have written or be quiet you silly billy
it's literally factually better, reduces overhead and time spent on nonsense, and will lower the hurdles for people to just try a new alternative, which will raise software quality

Replies

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

@professionalbigot69@poa.st remote

@WandererUber the command line cannot read your mind
least not yet

Replying to @professionalbigot69@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@professionalbigot69 walk me through your "thought" process here. How is saying a computer can't *divine* what I want a counter to offering a wizard where I *specify* what I want

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

@professionalbigot69@poa.st remote

@WandererUber read your grimoire, chigga

Replying to @professionalbigot69@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@professionalbigot69 You can't really defend your position. Every time someone does this I just chalk it up as a win. Guess I'm right, like always

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

@professionalbigot69@poa.st remote

@WandererUber you want to carry thunderstorm without even practicing you're incantations
you'll never be a grand wizard with that sort of thinking

Replying to @professionalbigot69@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@professionalbigot69 Quite the opposite. If I carry a magic artifact, I don't want to do a million years of cloistered research to use it. If this is necessary, I can just do it myself.

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

Living Space Studios

@LivingSpaceStudios@poa.st remote

@WandererUber @professionalbigot69 Discoverability has always been a huge problem with command lines. It's a big part of the reason why GUI based systems wound up becoming the default forms of user interaction. Modern programming software somewhat fixes this with command palettes but it's still somewhat vague at times about what a given command does.

Replying to @LivingSpaceStudios@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@LivingSpaceStudios @professionalbigot69 knew at least someone would get it, thanks man

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

Living Space Studios

@LivingSpaceStudios@poa.st remote

@WandererUber @professionalbigot69 The counter problem with GUI systems is that they often lack quick forms of user expression. People have been arguing about the role of visual interfaces and their relation to the Noun->Verb paradigm versus the Verb->Noun paradigm since before Unix was a thing and no one has reached a true 100% consensus yet.

Replying to @LivingSpaceStudios@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@LivingSpaceStudios @professionalbigot69 idk if it's that deep for the thing I want. I mean text user interface is one thing, but this is just a wizard but on the command line.
I don't wanna click around with the mouse like a retard, keyboards are just faster. and just making it a bit faster and less annoying was the whole point. and people be chewing my ear off about conventions and unix architecture 💀

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

Living Space Studios

@LivingSpaceStudios@poa.st remote

@WandererUber @professionalbigot69 To be honest, most of the old conventions and contrivances are based around hardware that was slower than most modern calculators that they give to school children.

In the modern era, there's nothing actually stopping anyone from developing a command line program that automatically does manual lookups and suggests common command line strings to the user similar to the auto complete systems available in every modern programming IDE.

It's always strange how people push beginners to use the command line in Linux and then poopoo fixing Terminal or Konsole to make them more useful or user friendly.

Replying to @LivingSpaceStudios@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@LivingSpaceStudios yeah. I've been reading the unix haters handbook a bit since Lain recommended it to me a couple times, and they have a point with some of it, I gotta say.
All these silly contrivances people have stacked and stacked for decades at this point are just cruft and they feel cumbersome and stupid.

>developing a command line program that automatically does manual lookups and suggests common command line strings to the user similar to the auto complete systems available in every modern programming IDE.
that's actually super cool and if if it did that by building a db of all available flags that would be even better. What's crazy is that even less than that is apparently too much to ask. Stuck in the 1980s forever

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

March 16th, The Hatkeshiator

@HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social remote

@WandererUber @professionalbigot69 well i mean even in high fantasy settings, magic tends to be idiosyncratic and unpredictable. the archetypal wizard devotes his life to studying what is literally called the arcane, in-universe, and may or may not come away with useful skills.

Replying to @HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@HatkeshiatorTND @professionalbigot69 pic rel (and if you use an artifact, you don't have to do that because it includes the spell, ready-made)

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

March 16th, The Hatkeshiator

@HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social remote

@WandererUber @professionalbigot69 'tism moment on my part
in any case, how is this different from usage examples in the manpage or helptext? why doesn't `man cmd | grep whatever` or `cmd -? | grep whatever` work?

Replying to @HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@HatkeshiatorTND it's extra steps it would be cooler if it was inline. It would also "work" if you had to "learn" a website by going to man.org/website.foo
and read about how the search syntax works and then typing website.foo/search?q=bar or whatever, but we don't do that the program shows you in the program what it can do. So I feel like if the information is already inside ("what flags do I support") then adding a lil wizard that helps along wouldn't hurt. Have you played counter strike? Have you opened the buy menu? Like that.

Replying to @professionalbigot69@poa.st

VIc FooReeee 🚀 📈 💰

@VIcFury@poa.st remote

@professionalbigot69 @WandererUber ask an AI to read the grimoire and generate the options you need.

Replying to @VIcFury@poa.st

Wanderer atop the sea of clouds or whatever

@WandererUber@poa.st remote

@VIcFury @professionalbigot69 people do this because it's niggercoal to have one program accept
tar anclpaiumdlv
and the other
yt-dlp --foo-option --bar-option

I don't want to know your stupid idiosyncracies, I just want the damn file. It should be obvious that a utility program should have the most utility for the least amount of cognitive work

Replying to @WandererUber@poa.st

@professionalbigot69@poa.st remote